Questions & Answers

February, 2003

Inquirer 1

Hi,
My name is Jen and I have a bunch of questions. I'm sorry to throw these at you all at once, but I've been making a collection for quite a while! I own 2 budgies and 1 cockatiel. The two budgies are both males and both pied (one yellow and green (Freckles), the other blue and white T.J.)). I've noticed something about my budgies. Most of their beak is a tan color, but along the sides of the beak there is a gray streak. I've noticed that some budgies have it and some don't. Is this a genetic thing or is this a nutritional issue?

Tri-State Response:
Jen
I am assuming you are talking about the hard beak itself. If this is the case, it is nothing to concern yourself with.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Jen's Next Question
Freckles was a rescue bird from a local shop and he had to have the tip of one of his front toes removed. I've noticed that the first pad on that toe is flat and slightly red. I'm thinking this could be a case of bumblefoot starting. Do you have any suggestions that might help me with his toe?

Tri-State Response: Jen

I am aware this condition occurs in canaries. I do not think it happens to budgies. It sounds like a pressure point callus that has formed where that toe hits the perch. Again, I would not worry. Birds are very adaptive to losing a part of a foot. They can even still breed in most cases. You should check the perches to see if there is a rough area that may be causing the problem. Also, watch the bird when it is standing to see if there is a different size of perch or a landing that you could use to change the point of contact where the redness is occurring.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Jen's Next Question
I have another question too. How can I encourage my birds to eat more..well...anything that is people food? They eat pellets and seed.

Tri-State Response:
Jen
Not sure what you have tried. Corn on the cob is usually relished along with broccoli, spinach, grated carrot, peas, sliced apple or orange (sticky though) moist bread, pasta, etc. They tend to learn from each other and tame birds often steal from their owner's plates or even mouths. Either they like people food or don't, just try different things and see. Most birds won't eat pellets and yours do.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Jen's Next Question
All the birds went to the vet in October for a thorough exam. It was Freckle's second visit and T.J.'s first. Both showed elevated liver enzyme levels. I'll give you the numbers. Is this normal for budgies? Or could this be a nutritional issue? Do elevated liver enzymes mean on going liver damage or could they indicate past liver damage that is no longer happening?

Freckles:
March 14, 2001
AST (Reference Number is 30 - 400 for normal) 557 U/L
CK (Reference Number is 50 - 2000 for normal) 1440 U/L
URIC (Reference Number is 2 - 11.2 for normal) 4.2 mg/dl

October 4, 2002
AST (Reference Number is 30 - 400 for normal) 446 U/L
Ca (Reference Number is 4.5 - 12.5 for normal) 9.64 mg/dl
CK (Reference Number is 50 - 2000 for normal) 228 U/L
GLU (Reference Number is 100 - 400 for normal) 320.9 mg/dl
URIC Reference Number is 2 - 11.2 for normal) 5 mg/dl

T.J.
October 4, 2002
AST (Reference Number is 30 - 400 for normal) 416 U/L
Ca (Reference Number is 4.5 - 12.5 for normal) 8.11 mg/dl
CK (Reference Number is 50 - 2000 for normal) 306 U/L
GLU (Reference Number is 100 - 400 for normal) 302.4 mg/dl
URIC Reference Number is 2 - 11.2 for normal) 4.8 mg/dl

I know you may not have answers to these questions, but I'll take any idea you may have.
Thanks!
Jen

Tri-State Response:
Jen
You paid a vet for the tests, I believe you should be getting your answers there. The numbers do not seem that concerning to me. I am a breeder, not a vet. I will give you my opinion though. I guess my first comment would be why are you taking the birds to a vet for thorough exams, which include blood work? Unless the birds show signs of illness, personally, I would not subject them to this as I feel it is stressful, expensive and not really necessary. The reference ranges I have are different from the ones you have provided. Mine are for avian species, not budgies in particular, and they are over ten years old. This could explain the disparity in numbers as yours may be based on more current findings and specific to budgies. I don't know the ages of the birds when they were tested or how long after they were obtained by you, that the tests were performed. Diet could very well be responsible. I do not believe in pelleted feed (although many folks and vets do) and would say that is most likely the reason for any elevated levels of liver enzymes. Often pelleted feed contains higher levels of protein than birds need. Over time, when there is too much protein it can cause damage to the liver. Remember that pellets contain additives in addition to grain. This is "supposed" to provide a complete diet. If you are also giving additional vitamins, minerals, supplements, seed and foods; it may be you that is causing an imbalance and actually overdosing the birds for certain vitamins, proteins, minerals, etc., which in turn would overload organs like kidneys and liver. The breeders I know do not use pellets. We prefer seed, vegetables, fruits, sprouted seed, cooked egg, and if breeding, use a nestling food, bread or gamebird crumbles.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Further Tri-State Response:
Thank you for writing Jen. Hopefully, the answers will be of help. I do not know where you live, but it may be useful to you to join a local club if you are not already a member of one. They can be a great source of information and friendship. Clubs like ours also put out a monthly newsletter as well that is full of information that members can learn from.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 2

I have two grandchildren, almost 5 yrs. and 1-1/2 yrs. They have a cat. At what age, if ever, would you recommend they have a budgie as a pet?
Jan

Tri-State Response:
Probably age 5 is OK but always under supervision around the bird. I would say the same for any pet, even a fish. A loose bird or pet can be stepped on, sat on, etc. The bird or other pet should be kept where it can be enjoyed. Children should be kept from hitting the cage, feeding harmful things to the pet, poking things through the bars, pulling the tail, putting their hands in and chasing or squeezing the pet and other common sense things. The younger child especially needs to be watched, as at that age they have no concept of what a pet is and how to be gentle. A cage can easily end up on the floor. Also, hookbills and other animals can provide a nasty bite on young and adult flesh. Kids are curious. An adult should do taming and training.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Jan's Response:
Marcia,
Thanks so much for a complete and thoughtful answer!
Jan

Inquirer 3

Which is the most common budgie?
Kar

Tri-StateResponse:
If you were talking about show specimens, I would say the normal light greens are the most commonly seen. Of the pet variety, probably a sky-blue or one of the pied varieties would be the most popular purchases. Most pet stores want fancier birds to sell and shun the plain greens.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 4

What is the normal life span of a budgie and what type of toys do they normally enjoy? Do they tend to be happier when living in pairs or does a single pet budgie do okay?
Kar2

Tri-State Response:
A rough estimate is the pet type can live up to 10 or even 14 years. The exhibition birds (kept as pets) will live up to about 6 or 8 years. There are many toys on the market. The ones than wobble or roll can be fun, mirrors, bells, a piece of sisal rope, are all OK. A piece of tree limb like maple or peach (not toxic) will be enjoyed as they strip off the bark. These birds live in colonies of hundreds or thousands in their native land. If you are planning on making the bird a true pet and taking it out of the cage and being its companion, only get one. If you don't have the time to share your life with the bird and it will remain alone and caged most of the time by all means get it a friend. It does not have to be a male female combination.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 5

What toys do these birds seem to enjoy most? Also, are they happy living alone, or do they need other budgies to be happy?
Thanks --- Jeff

Tri-State Response:
There are many toys on the market. The ones than wobble or roll can be fun, mirrors, bells, a piece of sisal rope, are all OK. A piece of tree limb like maple or peach (not toxic) will be enjoyed as they strip off the bark. These birds live in colonies of hundreds or thousands in their native land. If you are planning on making the bird a true pet and taking it out of the cage and being its companion, only get one. If you don't have the time to share your life with the bird and it will remain alone and caged most of the time by all means get it a friend. It does not have to be a male female combination.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

March 2003

Inquirer 1

Hi,
I am having trouble trimming my budgies toenails. Please could you email me back soon with some tips.
Sincerely,
Maria

Tri-State Response:
Hi Maria,
Thank you for sending along your question to The Tri-State Budgerigar Society regarding toenail trimming. When the bird is starting to have difficulty walking, climbing the bars in the cage, snagging the nails on fabric or is downright painful to you when those gripping feet perch on you, it is time for a toenail trim. It would help to have someone either hold the bird while you cut the bird's nails or cut while you hold the bird. In this way the toe can be steadied between the fingers of the person doing the cutting and you will avoid an accident. You must be careful not to trim too far and cut the vein that runs through the nail. A lot of blood can come pouring out of that cut and it is probably painful to the bird as well. The longer the nail, the longer this vein will be. If the nails are really long, do not try and trim them all the way back. Trim only the points off and then do a little more in about a week or so. This will allow the vein in the nail, also called the quick, to recede before the next step of the trim. There should be enough length left to wrap around the perch somewhat. It is better to leave the nail a bit too long than to cut too far back. On some birds the nail is a dark gray and on others the nail is almost clear and you will actually be able to see the quick and avoid cutting it. If you are unsure or uncomfortable cutting the nails (or wing feathers), have it done by a pet shop that does this service or by a vet. There are products you might want to consider trying that should eliminate the need to cut toenails. They work by filing the nails as the bird perches or walks. One is a perch made of cement and the other is a cover made out of sandpaper that you could slip over a perch. I would not recommend using either of these as all of the perches or to use them all the time. Because they are rough they could cause abrasions or sores to develop on the bottom of the feet or toes. You could try using these items as needed and then remove them when the nails wear down or use them as one perch in the cage (not the one in front of the food dish) and keep an eye out for any foot problems.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

November, 2003

Inquirer 1

I bought my budgie with clipped wings........now i've heard they will grow back? Will they? and if so approx how long will it take?.........cuz right now Lucky can't fly.......i hope u can answer my question......thanx!

Tri-State Response: Yes, the flight feathers will grow back and will need to be trimmed again for the bird's safety. You can do it yourself or ask if the pet store or breeder will if you do not know how. They may do it for free if you are a regular customer or charge a nominal fee. When it is time for the bird to go through it's moult, those cut wing feathers will fall out, like baby teeth, and be replaced by new feathers. This may be in as little as a few weeks or several months from now.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 2

Hi,
I had recently written about my Budgie's wings being clipped and if they will grow back.......now i understand that yeah its safer to keep them clipped......but i feel bad when Lucky tries to fly but can't......like will that put a damper on his mood in the future.....cuz whenever i take him out of the cage.......he's always trying to fly and i feel like he gets sorta depressed that he can't function in the way god intended him too......like if i make sure that the environment around him is safe before i take him out of the cage........would it be ok if i didn't clip his wings?.......and also what are the dimensions that you would suggest for a budgie cage?........please advise.......i would appreciate it.....thanx

Tri-State Response:
It is your bird and your choice to clip or not clip wings. I will say the following and then you do what you wish. After your bird attempts flight several times, it will finally realize it can not fly and will most likely stay put until it figures out the flight feathers have grow back. Just be careful that it can not harm itself in the tumble to the ground. Try to use a table or the bed for training in the beginning while it is learning it can not fly anymore. In the wilds of Australia, a budgie has to fly for food, water, finding a mate, escaping from predators, etc. In the wilds of your house in a domesticated setting, flight is not necessary as everything it needs comes from you. If the bird is a breeder or you have no desire to tame it and take it out of the cage, there is no need to cut the flights. A pet bird will select flight if it is capable rather than hanging out with you. Many pet birds meet their ends every day in pots of boiling water, flying into mirrors or windows, flying outside through an open door and so on. Flightless birds are also in danger of being stepped on, chewing electrical cords, etc. As far as cage size, it really depends on if the bird is always kept in the cage or is allowed out when it would get plenty of exercise. A good average size would probably be about 12" x 18" x 16"H.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

January, 2004

Inquirer 1

Hi,
My name is Dara. I'm a new budgie owner. I didn't expect to get budgies when i turned 17 but I did and now I have two of the most cutest budgies ever. I have a couple of questions. I will get any thing for my budgies to keep them happy and healthy. I just wanted to know if its normal for them to scratch at themselves and bite themselves. They scratch there necks like a dog would and they are always preening. Is this normal or do you think they have some type of mites or something? They scratch each other too. My second question was my room. It is not exactly budgie friendly yet they love to walk around on the floor and eat small things that i cant see right after I've vaccumed. Is it ok for them to eat things off the floor? Other then this they are two happy birds. I just want them to be comfortable, Im concerned they are scratching themselves to much.

Thanks so much.
Dara

Tri-State Response:
Hi Dara,
Regarding the scratching, it could be dry skin, new feathers growing in or mites. The mites are very tiny and you would not see them unless there was a large infestation. If there are mites that are full of blood from feasting on your friends, you may spot them slowly moving around as dark colored dots. Thoroughly wash and rinse the cage, dishes and toys with hot soapy water. Before putting the bird back in the cage, purchase some mite and lice spray made for birds (Rich Health Feather Glo is one) and spray the bird following directions. It may be a good idea to do two or three applications over a couple of weeks. It is a safe product with feather conditioners and can be used every few weeks. Budgies are curious and as long as there is nothing harmful on the floor for the bird to pick at, it is fine. If it is a non-carpeted floor, the birds may be seeing their reflection and responding to that in a playful manner.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 2

Hello,
My name is Hossein. I bought two Budgerigar last year, they were very wild. I tried to tame them, but it did not work, so they are still wild. Anyway the male showed that he is really very smart. About 6 months ago they began to lay eggs. They layed 7 eggs every 3 weeks, and each time they break or throw out them. Now it is less than a month that three (3) eggs hatched. I have 3 chicks now. they differ in size and color. i here name them 1,2,3 where 1 is bigest and 3 is smallest. Two of them, 1 and 2, are a copy of male and 3 is a copy of female. my male is yellow limb with light green breast (so beautiful) and female is dark green and black limb with hard green breast. well...now each one is geater , and 1 is completely look like his father. I want to tame the chicks that they can be free in home. I tried to get 1 several times, but he bite me and ran over the cage. Please tell me what to do? Also, how can I find that out whether the chicks are male or female?
I thank for any suggestion else...THANX a lot.

Tri-State Response:
Dear Hossein,
Thank you for writing to Tri-State. I get similar questions all the time and rather than write an answer over and over, I am going to copy you the answers I have already given in the past exactly as I wrote them regarding taming, etc. It may not fit you perfectly but it will help. Males are known to be the better pets and talkers. Very young birds are harder to sex for the novice person but as they get to be about three months and older you will see the nostril area above the beak change color. The females (hens) will be whitish blue, eventually turning a tan to brown color and appear crusty when they are mature. This can be anytime after six months of age. The same area in males (cocks) will stay smooth. The color will be either a pinkish purple or vivid blue, depending on what variety the bird is. Here follows more copied exactly as I wrote it the first time I was asked.

Each bird and household is different so it is hard to answer. I would say that up to two weeks should be allowed for a new bird to settle down before taming. Remember the bird came from a cage with it's parents, then was probably housed with other youngsters at the breeder's place, then transported to a pet store with new sounds, food, surroundings and cage mates and now is at your house.

The females tend to be the biters but this action does not necessarily mean it is a girl. Is it just curious and using the beak to explore or is the nipping downright painful? My suggestion is to not try and take the bird physically out of the cage for the first two weeks. It has already been put through a lot of stressful activity in its young life. Instead, spend some time next to the cage talking quietly and moving slowly so the bird is not scared by rapid movement. Do this several times a day if you are able, for about five to ten minutes for each session. Work your way up to resting a hand on the side of the cage and holding it there steady. The bird will start to show an interest in you and then your visits in a few days can have a hand go in the cage. Hold the hand steady, not trying to grab birdie. When you can keep your hand in there for a couple of minutes without the bird flapping all over, put a finger up to it's lower chest and press a bit to get it to stand on a finger. This is a major achievement. After it does this freely when you go in the cage it can be brought out to play.

If the bird really starts to go wild or show fright, back off somewhat to where the bird shows calm. So if everything was fine when your finger was three inches from the bird and when you move closer the bird panics, move back to the three inch mark for the session. If the bird has not had its wings clipped by the pet store, you may wish to have this done by them. It will prevent the bird from wildly flying full force into windows, mirrors, walls, pots of boiling spaghetti, etc. but you need to be careful when it is first done. The bird will try to take off and not know it cannot fly anymore. You want to be low to the ground so it will not fall far if it tries to fly. In a few weeks or months, the clipped flight feathers will fall out and regrow. Once tamed, you may want to allow the bird the freedom to fly. It is still a good idea to keep the wing feathers trimmed to prevent outdoor escape or injury. Some birds will be tam in a day or two of doing this and others may take two weeks or more. A lot depends on how often you work with the creature and whether or not the breeder handled the bird frequently before selling it.

Do not put a mirror in the cage if you want it to be a companion bird. The males can learn to talk, I have never heard of a talking female. The same one or two words have to be repeated slowly, hundreds of times to the bird over several weeks or months. Training to talk requires a lot of patience. Start with "hello" or your name or "good morning" when you first enter the room. A child's or woman's voice is generally higher pitched than a man's and works better. It could take weeks or months but when they master the first words, they learn new ones faster. Keep in mind that if it turns out to be a female, it most likely will not talk but can still make a great pet. There are many inexpensive books that your pet or book store or your library should have that give more advice.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. What I mean is you need to make up your mind what it is you are trying to do. Do you want a pet to play with, share your breakfast with, have it ride your shoulder and snuggle your neck and so on? Or do you just want a few colorful chattering birds to enjoy in a large cage? Are you trying to breed them because you think you have to buy them as pairs? Are you thinking you will make some money from selling babies? Are you breeding birds because you plan on exhibiting them?

First, I have no idea how old the birds are that you purchased. Are you positive you have a true pair in each cage? They may be too young to breed or too old to be considered easily tameable. If you want them to breed and I can assume they are old enough -- leave them alone and stop disturbing them. They will not breed if you keep chasing them around and trying to tame them. Generally, these birds require a few pairs in the same area to stimulate them to breed, for the most success, as long as they are of breeding age -- eight months or more of age. For a tame pet, you should start with a young bar head about seven to ten weeks old -- one - not pairs. Budgies are colony birds and when they have the company of other budgies or a mirror, they will bond with them, not the owner. If you have too many and especially if they are not youngsters; it will be very difficult or even impossible to tame your birds. When one bird gets frightened, it alarms the others. You may eventually get them tamed but don't count on that.

As far as how long it is taking to get eggs and chicks once birds are old enough and set up for breeding; it depends on your set up, lighting, nutrition, how often you are bothering them and many variables. Certain birds will never display any interest in breeding during their lifetime and some will eat eggs that are laid. Some hens will lay eggs and never incubate them. Enjoy the birds no matter what but if you want a true pet, then you may have to get a young bird and start over. Keep it by itself away from the other birds and bond with it.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

April, 2004

Inquirer 1

Hi,
I recently came across your web site when I was trying to find information on my budgie. I purchased a parakeet in Sept. from a breeder for my son. (Although it is I who is extremely smitten with this pet.) She was six weeks old. Ruthie is a great bird and is very entertaining. Ruthie is already saying about 20-30 words. I am truly amazed! I do, however, have two questions I was hoping you can help me with the answers.

1. Ruthie's area above his/her beak is purple. I know females are usually tan or pink, and males are blue. I am assuming purple is closer to blue, and therefore Ruthie is probably a boy. Do you think this assumption is correct?

2. The more important question is Ruthie's temperament. Usually Ruthie had a fine disposition. He is friendly and playful, and really likes to sit on your shoulder and talk up a storm. Ruthie does not really liked to be patted though. In addition, about 2-3 days a month Ruthie becomes a little aggressive and tries to bite us. Actually, he has not done this in quite some time, so I thought maybe he was getting over this "biting" thing. However, tonight he really wanted to come out, but when I took him out and tried to pat him, he tried to bite us several times. He probably bit harder than he ever has, but he still did not break the skin. I've tried to read up on the matter, but have yet to decipher as to why he does this. Do you have any ideas as to why or how to correct this problem. Any help you can give me would greatly be appreciated.

I've done some more research, and I noticed that some parakeets feel their space is invaded. I don't think this is my case. Ruthie always wants to come out. Even when she bit tonight, she had jumped on me to come out. Thank you in advance for your help.

Caroline

Tri-StateResponse:
Caroline,
Sorry for not responding sooner. I was away on vacation. As far as the purple/pink cere area, you are probably right that it is a male. The bird is more than six months old so the cere color is set. Also, a large vocabulary indicates it is most likely a male. You did not describe the bird's color or state what variety it is. Most of the rare varieties like harlequins (recessive pieds), fallows (red eyes), and birds that would be pure yellow or white as with dark eyed clears do not have blue ceres in the male and would be the pink color you are referring to. You seem to have diagnosed the reason for biting as the bird being territorial and protecting it's space from you the invader. You are right. You are confused by "Ruthie's" wanting to come out and why you are being bit when you try to grant the request. It is simple. The bird wants to come out - he does not want you to go in. Why don't you just open the door and allow the bird to emerge from the cage on its own? Once the bird is away from the door and it's cage, it will probably show less agression when it is in neutral territory. Perhaps have a reward waiting like a piece of fruit for good behavior. Also, if the cage is set high or on a stand, the bird feels superior. You might want to consider putting the cage lower so you will be higher than the bird, if this is your set up.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 2

Is it possible for budgies with the same kind of sex to be a pair? I have 4 budgies (2 males and 2 females) and it seems like the 2 females have become lovers or a pair. Could it be possible that both of them think that they are with a male budgie?

thanks
Carlos

Tri-State Response:
Carlos,
Sometimes birds of the same sex will bond when caged together. Males especially, will often feed each other, dilate their eyes as if in courtship and fly to each other in a cage or flight. Can't say if there are "gay" birds and personally, I have never witnessed same sex birds actually try to mate. Birds like this may or may not go on to mate and rear families. If you are trying to breed your pairs, it is best to separate the true pairs into their own cages. Sometimes, a bird can be fussy about who it will mate with and refuse a bird of a certain color or variety. Perhaps your two hens are not interested in the color or variety of the males they are with, if they are different. The hens may have also come from the same source and might be friends from way back.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

May/June, 2004

Inquirer 1

Hello! My name is Courtney. I'm 14. I just purchased a parakeet about 3 days ago. Her breed is "rare parakeet." She's green and yellow and about 4 months old. I'm not sure if she's a female because her cere has not changed color yet. I'm trying to train her. I wish it could be easier but sometimes she can be stuborn. She's young so she may not understand, but I've done tons of research and would like some tips from you. Her wings are not clipped and the closest avian vet is in cape girardeau one hour away from my home. Please email me back with any tips. I'm worried that she's not eating her food. I've put a spray millet in her cage and I've only witnessed her eating it but not her food. I'm afraid she may become malnourished if she doesn't eat her food. I've also done research about how to keep her well-nourished but she is not eating her food. Her wings are not clipped and to let her exercise I let her out of her cage and fly around the room but it is hard to recapture her and I let her out un-handtrained and so she won't come to me when I call "up" and hold up my finger so I have to capture her in my palm and I'm scared either she or I may get injured from me holding her with my palm or her biting me. I need help and I know its not reccomended to buy a parakeet on impulse but I do know a lot of info on them now. I'm just having trouble applying it to my parakeet. She's young and she does get on my finger when I provoke her but many of the training methods I've tried have sort of failed so i need help. Her name is Dixie and I love her to death. I just want that special bond with her that other people have with their budgies. Please give me any advice you can!

Tri-State Response:
Courtney,
Slow down with the bird. If you have done as much research as you claim you have, you should realize you are being impatient and stressing out that poor bird. It does not surprise me that it does not seem to be eating. You even admit the bird is not hand trained, you had it for only three days and the wings are not clipped but yet you seem to expect the bird to be your best friend and want to hang out with you. You let it out where it can slam into all kinds of things and then chase after it to grab it and put it back in the cage. I am not going to spend a lot of time with you on this because you are fully aware that you are not applying all of your knowledge to your pet so it would be a waste of my time. Here is my brief bit of advice to you. The bird is about 4 months old and you are the third place it has lived at since that time. Give it some time (10 to 14 days) to get used to a new cage, where the food and water cups are located, new surroundings in the room, your face and clothing and even new sounds or the lack of familiar sounds. Clipping wings makes the taming process easier, but, if this is not possible, it can still be done. It will take more patience and being careful. Many birds escape houses through open doors when they can fly or end up killing themselves by flying into windows, mirrors or into things cooking on a stove. To me, it seems the bird is very stressed at this point. Leave the bird absolutely alone for the next three days, other than to give food and water. Keep at least a few feet from the cage when you are in the room with it. This period of time will allow the bird to gain some confidence and not feel threatened by you. It is OK to keep using millet spray until the bird finds the seed cups. Budgies prefer not to use the hooded type of cups.

Then start the training process by spending some time, several times a day, next to the cage. Talk softly to the bird during this three-day period. Allow the bird to see you up close but do not put your hands on or near the cage and do not move suddenly. The birdcage should be level with your upper body and head in the room for the best results. In other words, the bird should not be looking up at you or down at you. Try to use the same one or two words you want it to say many times a day. Try "good morning" first thing in the morning or "hello" whenever you enter the room.

By about the seventh day, if you follow my tips, the bird will most likely start to show an interest in you and be curious when you come close to the cage. If the bird is still nervous or afraid, it will tighten its feathers and move away from you when you approach. In this case give it a few more days of the soft talking near the cage. On the other hand, if the bird does not move away and seems to lift its shoulders or stretch a wing as you approach, you are ready for the third step. Open the door and slowly put a finger close to the bird. This is where the "up" comes in. Move as close as the bird will let you. As soon as the bird starts to move away or look scared, move back a bit and leave your finger in place. You are still talking softly to the bird while doing this and moving slowly. Do not attempt to take the bird out. Keep repeating this step several times a day. After a few days the bird should readily step on your finger. Then try giving some fruits, bread or vegetable of some kind in you hand to coax the bird to accept food and to be fearless about your hand. The treats work to get the bird to look forward to your "visits." When you are positive that the bird readily hops on your finger or hand and climbs on the bars close to you to signal it wishes to be with you, you can try taking it out of the cage. This may take longer than the two-week period. Let it be up to the bird -- not you. If you rush the process, you will be back at the beginning or end up with a bird that is ruined as a loving pet. Keep in mind that some birds (like dogs) become very territorial, protective and aggressive regarding their "space" and will bite if you go into their cage. If this starts to happen in a few months, it will usually help to open the cage door and allow the bird to come out on its own into your "space." If you take the bird out and it flies off your finger. Give it a few minutes to settle down, unless it is in harms way. Keep curtains and doors to other rooms closed and mirrors covered. If you calmly go to the bird and put out you finger, it should be tame and comfortable enough with you to get back on your finger. If it requires you must still chase the bird to get it back in the cage, do not let it out again for another week or so and continue with in cage training and bonding. It would be a good idea to get a net instead of chasing with your hands. Good luck.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Courtney Replies:
Thank you so much for your advice. Her wings were clipped today and I'm hoping this will help with the training process. I realize that she has shown signs of being uncomfortable that I have not noticed before. I will be more aware from now on and I will back off some. I feel a little bit guilty about being so forceful with her but I realize that now and shes finished eating her millet and it has been taken out of her cage she is now eating very well out of her seed cups I've tried hand feeding her treats and things but she does not like hand feeding she only eats it if it has been layed down in front of her she seems to be getting closer to me and trusting me more because, when I let her out of her cage, she stays by me and sometimes walks up on my feet or lap and seems to be interested in the food I eat around her. She's very curious and she has a beautiful singing voice.
LOL Thanks so much for your advice.
Courtney,

Tri-State Response:
Courtney,
Glad you have made progress with your bird training. It was good that you realized you just had to give it some time and patience. By now you should have a great pet in the works.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 2

I was wondering if you had any suggestion for breeders in the Los Angeles Area. Thanks,

Brett

Tri-State Response:
Brett,
If you go back to our club web site http://www.tri-statebudgie.org, you can click on the links for BAA and ABS and find the links to members web sites. I do not know where LA is in relation to them. You can try to contact these people and perhaps they can help you or guide you in the right direction. For BAA, try Bill Novickas - Exhibition Budgie & Zebra Finch or Lou Smaldino - Legacy Aviaries. ABS lists breeders by state and there are three for CA.

You can also try contacting the secretaries of the clubs in your area for some breeder names. You will find the links to ABS and BAA on our web site and from there, a list of clubs.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 3

Hello,
I'm a member of the budgie assoc of america and live in the tri-state area. I'm not an active member because I don't breed or have show birds. However, I have 4 budgies and desparately need some advice.

I have been feeding my budgies a mixture of Harrison's high potency pellets, seeds, and Harrison's mash. I've been trying to convert them to a pellet diet for a while - they seem to eat the mixture (i.e., a little of everything). Two weeks ago one of my little guys was diagnosed with kidney disease and my vet said she has a few weeks to live. A member (who has bred birds her whole life) of our local bird society here on Long Island told me that Harrison's has been known to cause kidney and liver disease. I've been so devastated over this - she suggested I give them an all seed diet - Harrison's provides excessive vitamins - and to give them aloe detox to try to save my little bird.

I'm trying to nurse my budgie back to health- although the vet said this was definitley a fatal disease. I need advice - what should I feed them? seeds? pellets (other than Harrison's)? Help! Is this "rumor" correct about Harrison products? I do give them fresh veggie every day (they don't like fruit). Please - I really need advice!

Thank you,
Nancy

Tri-State Response:
Nancy,
Thank you for visiting our web site. Since you do live in the Tri-State area, please try and attend our show on July 17 in Monroe Township, NJ. It is near exit 8A on the NJ Turnpike and details and directions can be found on our web site http://www.tri-statebudgie.org/ This year we have obtained 1st to 10th place awards for a Pet Division, which we are not advertising because it is not BAA sanctioned. We do have a few people such as you in the club that do not breed or exhibit show birds but have pets. This is an opportunity for them to participate. We wanted to be prepared in the event someone came to the show with pets and would not want to turn them away. The show is a good way to meet some new friends and perhaps win a prize or two from the raffle table.

Now I will try to respond to your questions and concerns. I have been a breeder and exhibitor of parakeets and budgies and have been in Tri-State for over twenty years. I am a member of ABS and BAA, show as an intermediate and have read many books and publications. I also worked for a small avian pet supplies company for six years that manufactured cage birdseed mixes under the Apples Aviary name. I am not a vet but I think I know what I am doing and can give you an honest opinion. I personally have never heard of Harrisons pellets so I cannot comment specifically on them but I am familiar with brands like Ziegler. I agree with your Long Island friend with what she has told you. I am not sure if aloe will help but it probably cannot hurt. The people in our club, as well as myself, all use seed diets as the main food source. We supplement with a varied diet of raw or cooked vegetables, fruits, chickweed or other grasses, soaked or sprouted seed or grains, bread, honey sticks, gamebird crumbles (as a treat or with nestling food), cooked egg, nestling or egg food if breeding and perhaps pellets as a treat. I have had people write to me about the same problems that you are experiencing while using pellets. Death often results so be prepared, although the bird may recover if the damage to organs is not yet severe. Here is my take on pellets or the mash you are referring to. I am totally against their use as the straight diet for a pet bird. Many people, articles or even vets, will tell you that pellets are the best thing to use as a 100% nutritionally complete diet and that they should be given with seed, gradually reducing seed until you are using straight pellets. A lot of this is common sense and similar to how people eat and the requirements of other pets such as dogs and cats. Calories burned, individual metabolism rates, age, lifestyle, activity levels and other factors, all go into how healthy we all are inside and what size we are. When it comes to pets, people have this misconception that they should be buyng the best food available for their pets and to them, that means a high protein diet. These diets are often more expensive, also high in fat and contain higher levels of vitamins and minerals. As an example in dogs, a five-year-old working border collie needs and can utilize a high protein diet but a five year old apartment dwelling miniature poodle would end up with problems similar to your birds. It is so very important for workers where pet food is sold to help pet owners select the proper food for their particular pet under their conditions.

Pellet and mash diets were first developed for use in the poultry industry, especially for laying hens and growing baby chicks to market size. Poultry eat their food whole where it is processed in the gizzard. Free-range chickens would eat a variety of foods, grains, insects, worms, plant material and so on. The search for food and the ability to fly and run meant that they burned off a lot of calories and energy. This also means they took longer to reach market size, were less meaty and hens laid fewer eggs. Experimentation with various grains and ingredients to increase protein and studying nutritional analysis and weight gain and egg production of the chickens, they came up with the pellets and mashes. Confinement, breeding selection and the new feeds helped increase egg production and create a more meaty chicken that went to market faster. Here is the catch. Even though chickens can live for 10 or more years, these birds have a short lifespan because they are killed after a few weeks or about three years if a laying hen. There are no long-term effects from using this diet. Caged pet birds like yours eat mostly seed as their natural diet but they hull their seed before swallowing, unlike poultry. It is not natural to them to eat a 100% pelleted or mash diet. These pet birds do not utilize energy by flying about (as in the wild), are not raising families, do not live outdoors where they must contend with temperature change stress or contend with the rigors of being a show bird. There is no way they need the high protein, fat, carbs and excessive vitamins and minerals in a pelleted or mash diet. The birds must also drink a lot more water than natural for them to process this man made diet which is probably another reason for kidney failure. Their kidneys must work harder than nature intended. Your pets are basically couch potatoes like people sitting around eating things like fast food and milk shakes all day. People doing this end up obese, diabetic, have heart conditions, liver and kidney problems just like your birds. Why? Their lifestyle does not utilize all of the extra calories, carbohydrates and protein. It is not being burned off and the fat and excessive proteins are accumulating in the liver and the organs are being overloaded and stressed. Now you are seeing what your best thoughts are doing to the birds. A person with a desk job in an air-conditioned or heated office requires a lot less calories, carbs and protein than say a construction worker in the heat or cold of the day. A twenty-year-old athlete requires more that a seventy-year-old retiree. Do you see the connections between lifestyle and food requirements? I hope it is not too late to save your bird by a diet change but it may save the others. I would have to say that even though I do breed birds, show birds, give them access to flight and have raised them outdoors without heat or air-conditioning; I would still never consider putting them on a pelleted or mash diet. I do not think it is worth the risk and I feel the varied diet I use is more than adequate. I did use almost all mash with some scratch grain and whole corn with my chickens years ago. Let me know in a few weeks what happened or come introduce yourself to me if you attend our show.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Nancy's Reply:

Dear Marcia,
Thank you so very much for your very informative e-mail and for taking the time to write to me. I've been so distraught over this whole thing - I did spend a lot of money for the Harrison's mash and pellets ($30 for a 5 lb. bag) thinking I was giving them the best diet possible, only to find out I was actually doing damage. I'm so disappointed. The information you gave me on why the pellet diet does not fit the cage bird makes much sense. And the info you gave me on what to feed them was extremely helpful. The past two weeks have been just horrendous - I was going against my vet's advice and really wasn't sure what to believe or how to help her.

Although my little budgie showed some improvement with the Aloe Detox, I know you are most probably correct that this won't have a good ending. Her droppings have not improved at all - very liquidy. It breaks my heart because the other three really love her - one is her mate.

How could they push pellets when it causes kidney and liver damage? I was so shocked when you said that others have contacted you for the same reason. My vet said he surprised my bird looked as well as she did because her blood test results showed bad levels for her kidneys. I guess she has severe damage. He gave me Allopurinol but said it probably wouldn't help her much - and may stress her because I have to give it orally. I decided not to give her the medicine and to try the aloe detox. My vet said she would probably only last a few weeks (which was two weeks ago).

My budgies are kept in a nice large cage - but they are out most of the day - I have them in their own room with lots of toys - so they do burn some energy but I guess not nearly enough to work off the pellets. I have now given them different kinds of organic seeds, millet spray and lots of veggies. They don't like fruit - I gave it to them every day for about two months and they wouldn't go near it.

I really, really appreciate your advice and the information. Now that I'm over the shock of this, I'm trying to nurse her back to health and hope for the best.

I will keep checking your website for upcoming events - it looks like you have a great group of people and I would really like to meet them.

Thank you again so much.

Nancy

July/August, 2004

Inquirer 1

Hello! I have 2 male budgies (blue & yellow) that were rescued from the vets (they were to be put down). They used to be friends, but now the little blue one (who I think is quite a bit younger) has gone a little 'mad' and doesn't shut up, chases the other bird, and constantly regurgitates his food. It's the last of these traits I'm worried about! He does it in the same place - a rope swing I put in there - and it's as though he thinks it's another budgie and he's trying to feed it, or perhaps mate with it? I've taken the other bird out as he was being hounded (& I thought it might be a territorial ritual), but little Bluey still 'vomits' all the time. I'm worried none of the food he eats is actually being digested! Does this sound normal or will he grow out of it?

Thanks for any help

Sarah

Tri-State Response:
Sarah,
Your male is simply performing a mating display -- the chattering, regurgitating, chasing and probably beak clicking against something, head bobbing and eyes dilating. He simply is sexually mature and wants to mate. Since there is no female available he is displaying to the other bird in the cage. Two birds of the same sex are known to do this. Your choices are to separate them as you have and let them live alone. Or, separate them and find the bird a mate. You do not have to provide a nest box if you are not interested in breeding; however, you will have to keep watch as sometimes birds can get aggressive. They can even kill each other, even if their mating desires are fulfilled and even if kept in a large cage of many birds. Hens or cocks can be equally guilty of aggression. Either way, he will not die because of the regurgitation. You can also take out the swing. Mirrors usually have the same effect if in the cage.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Sarah Replies:

Dear Marcia,
Thanks! All the characteristics you've described are exactly what he's doing so I'll keep the 2 birds separate from now on (& take out the swing!)

Thanks again

Sarah

Inquirer 2

Hi,
I purchased a parakeet three days ago. Upon purchase my bird looked fine but now there are feathers missing from the crown of its head. Some of the feathers only have the center of the feather but not the soft part. Do you think it is mites? The remaining parts of my bird look unaffected so far.

Any insight?? Much appreciated.

KA

Tri-State Response:
You have not given me much information to go on. Are you seeing the bird scratch its head? Is the bird housed with another that could be aggressive to it and defending its cage? Could the bird simply be going through a moult and what you are seeing are the new pinfeathers growing in? These have blood in the new soft quills and if they break open there will be blood. If they rub their heads on the cage, they may rub these new feathers off. It could be mites. If you are not sure of the cause, get yourself and the bird back to the store with your receipt and ask the folks at the pet shop about it.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

KA Replies:

Thanks for your reply. I did go back to the store and we had come to the conclusion of molt or the bird may be doing this to itself although I have not seen the bird scratching. There are not other birds. Thanks again for your reply.
KA

Inquirer 3

My name is Badman. I live in London. I have just been looking at your site. I have gained some knowledge. I have currently a male and female pair of budgies. The male is an olive green with a yellow face. the female is a rainbow wing i was told by the pet shop owner. she is yellow with a blue tint. the male is wanting to mate but she is just not receptive to his advances. she is abot 6 months old. why will she not mate? also another query. THE MALE IS TALKING HUMAN TALK. HE ALSO SEEMS VERY WILD as in he swings about the tall plants in the house. He also has aliking for green chillies and other weird stuff. is that normal. she doesnt touch chillies, she only eats millet and seed. is that normal?

Tri-State Response:
Badman,
Thanks for visiting our site and letting us know where you are from. Six months is a bit young to breed, especially a hen. Allow at least nine months for safety, as she is basically a teenager now. You don't mention having a nest box available to the pair. This is necessary. Like people, birds have likes and dislikes regarding food preferences. The freedoms of the house along with mating displays are probably giving you the wild impression.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 4

Dear Marcia,
I'd like some more information about your show. We recently lost our parakeet, and are planning on another. Will there be any there for adoption? We don't want to go to a pet store, but rather a rescue or adoption. Is the show open to the public?
Thanks so much,
Mary

Tri-State Response:
Mary,
Thank you for asking about the show. If you would, please let me know how and where you found out about it. We are trying to track how best to get the word out about our show and club meetings. Yes, you are most welcome to come to our show. There will be people there starting at about 7:00 AM to set up. The actual judging starts about 10:30 AM and things wrap up around 4:00 PM. There will be a raffle table and birds for raffle and almost always birds for sale. As far as free birds for rescue, usually not. However, I personally have at least two or three younger green birds that were afflicted with French Moult as babies. They are about four months old now. This is not life threatening or contagious but affects growing feathers in the wings and tail rendering them useless as show birds or breeders. I prefer not to destroy birds like this and if you would like to give one or all of them good homes at no charge, I will be glad to bring them to the show for you to look at. They cannot fly and that would make them easier to tame. Let me know if you are interested.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 5

I wonder if you can help? I recently found some cuttlefish bone washed up on the beach. Knowing my friend had a budgie I brought some back for her to give to Charlie (the bird!). Is this safe to do so, or is cuttle fish normally treated before it's given to the bird? If you could, let us know.
Many thanks,
Sharon

Tri-State Response:
Sharon,
Thanks for taking the time to write. To be honest, I don't know if it would be safe. I don't know if cuttlefish are caught live and processed for the pet industry or they are found as you did. I would imagine that they are washed in some way and dried before being packaged. There is no way to know why the cuttlefish washed up on shore. There are too many variables. Was it alive when it washed up or dead? Dead things have bacteria working on them to help with the decomposition. Also, the waters could have been contaminated by something. On the other hand, there are a lot of trace elements in seawater that would be beneficial to the birds. I would have to say use your judgment on this one.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 6

I am trying to get some feather dusters. If you know of any breeders that may be willing to give these away please let me know. I have had 1 before and would love to get more.
Michelle

Tri-State Response:
Michelle,
You don't state where you are from. Our club is in the central New Jersey, USA area. Feather Dusters appear very rarely. They cannot be planned for and are basically a freak occurrence. They are not long lived, usually only several weeks to less than a year. Although they are beautiful to look at, they are considered sickly and are normally euthanized early on or die soon after when they should fledge. No breeders in the club have had any appear in the last few years. In the event any do hatch, you would need to be located close enough as no one would want to spend money or time to ship a free unhealthy bird. Most of us are not even interested in the hassle of shipping birds that are sold.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 7

My budgies have finally bonded (m and F) I sometimes catch them trying to mate (the male tries to go on top of the female) but it never happens because of the other birds in the cage. do i need to separate the couple from the other birds, or should i just wait for nature to take its course? Hoping for an immediate answer.
Thanks
Carlos

Tri-State Response:
Carlos,
You should separate the pair into their own cage as I said previously and supply the pair with a nest box if you expect results. Just because you do not witness mating, does not mean it is not happening. You should provide nestling food or soaked/sprouted seed, cooked egg or other soft foods to the breeding pair. This will aid them in coming into breeding condition and feeding their young. If you do not have one, get yourself a book to help you along.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Another Question from Carlos
what kind of nesting material do they use to build a nest? a friend had suggested to use shaved wood is that right? do i put it straight in the nest box or do i just put it in the cage floor and just allow them to bulid it themselves?? Thanks very much for your help
Carlos

Tri-State Response:
Carlos,
They do not build nests like finch family birds. In the wild they hollow out tree trunks and toss the chips out leaving a concave. Some breeders use only a wood nest box with a concave bottom and nothing else and have success. Most breeders prefer the wood nest box but pine shavings are usually used. Put a pile in the box. The hen will make a depression in them. Some hens will throw most or all of the chips out. You can put some of them back around the depression because the shavings help cushion the eggs and keep them from denting or breaking. Eggs normally appear between 7-14 days. Once a couple eggs are laid, leave the box alone as far as the chips go, even if she has thrown them out. After the chicks hatch and are starting to feather, you can add some to keep moisture and filth down in the box. Good luck.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Another Question from Carlos
I'm sorry for so much questions. but i can't help but ask another today. This morning when i checked my budgies, one of the females was just lying on the cage floor. when i picked it up, she was still strong like nothing was wrong with her. the problem was her legs couldnt move, (like it was broken or something, or paralyed) right now, i just put her in a different cage where she could reach her food and water. would you know whats wrong with her?? what should I do? please reply asap, thanks!
Carlos

Tri-State Response:
Carlos,
I am not a vet but it sounds like a case of paralysis or the hen is eggbound. Usually, if eggbound, there will be a swelling in the vent area and you may even feel an egg by gently pressing her abdomen. I have had both happen and know others that have too. The paralysis happens less frequently than the other does but they do sometimes happen at the same time. There is not much more you can do that what you did. Of course, you can get her to a vet if you are willing to pay the fees. The birds will usually recover from the paralysis in a few days. If she is eggbound, she may recover after passing or reabsorbing the egg. Hens sometimes prolapse from straining to pass the egg; the internal organs rupture outside the vent. They do often die, either from tiring, infection or from not being able to pass waste products because of the egg blockage. Either way, if she recovers, she will need several weeks of rest. If she bounces back and after a long rest you decide to attempt to breed her again (especially if she is young now) she may do just fine. It is possible the same condition may happen again due to a genetic defect or abnormality and then she will be useless as a breeder.
Breeders speculate that hens too young or too old most likely cause both syndromes at the time of breeding and the strain of passing eggs. Opinions vary and each bird is different but a minimum eight months of age for a hen and maximum of three years is about right for the exhibition type. The pet type may be ready a bit sooner and breed somewhat longer. The paralysis is probably caused by either the act of sitting in the nest box for so long and the muscles cramping up or weakening from lessened use or it is from the forming eggs pressing against nerves or other organs.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Carlos Replies:
thank you for your reply. the hen has died after 1 day. she kept trying to fly and land on the perch but was unsuccessful. so i think she died of tiredness. what a waste. anyways Thanks again for your help i really appreciate it.
Carlos

Inquirer 8

hi I have two budgies, Freckle (hen) and Pie (cock). I have been thinking of breeding them for a while now and am worried about the age of Freckle. I'm not 100% on her age but she is around 5 years old. I have seen people seeing ex-breeders at 3 year of age. Is she too old to start breeding? This would be her first clutch and I don't want to stress her out if she is too old. She is in good health and is showing all the sign of breeding condition - dark brown cere and striping branches of bark in short amount of time.
Jenni

Tri-State Response:
Jenni,
Tough call, as I don't know the birds health or physical attributes as in overweight, fatty tumors, bone structure, underweight, etc. It is probably not a good idea. Exhibition type hen budgies are past their prime for breeding at about three or four years of age. If it is a smaller pet type of hen, they are known to have longer lifespans and you may have success. Cocks can breed indefinitely if in good health but fertility may decline. You will have to ask yourself if it is worth the risk to you and if you will be able to accept the loss of her should something go wrong. If you just want to try your hand at breeding, it would be better to obtain a younger pair. Personally, I would not breed her.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Jenni Replies:
Thank you for answering, I have worked out she is only 4 not 5, I got her mid June 2000, but I think I will side with caution and not breed her. She is a small pet type and mainly feed on a seed diet - this is because I gave up too early with her and vegies. I'd rather have my little angle for as long as possible than losing her for babies budgies :)

Inquirer 9

Help, I have 2 budgies. I noticed 1 was "puffy" and the area on its lower back looked raised. These birds have not been handled. They are very friendly ,attentive when I am by the cage talking etc. but flutter away when I get my hand close. Anyway, I finally could see under it the way it was sitting and could see something, maybe hard stool. I did catch the bird long enough to try pulling gently on this and it did not come out, and with several very painful bites, put it back in the cage. I tried this 3 times with no success. I am afraid I am hurting it to "pull" on this, yet it is obvious it is not going to live if it doesn't "move". What can I do?? Its Sat.-no vet, plus no local vets "do birds".
(I inherited 2 budgies and 2 cockatiels from the nursing home I work at. I was the one feeding them and when the owners decided not to keep them they were given to me.) None of them let you handle them. I can't let them "out"- I have cats. The cockatiels were aldults given to the home separate owners, they have separate cages beside each other. The 2 budgies were bought @ a petsmart from a reidents family member. I think all males. Budgies may be about 2 years old. I am really concerned this bird will die-help please and thankyou. Oh, they eat "bonanza" parakeet seed by Hartz.
Sandra

Tri-State Response:
Sandra,
It is hard to make a diagnosis over the Internet. If it were a hen, I might suspect she was egg bound. One would be able to feel the egg in the vent region by a gentle squeeze. For some reason the hen is not able to pass an egg in much the same way a woman has difficulty at childbirth. The hen will usually die due to exhaustion, internal rupture of organs or toxemia due to the inability to pass waste. Sometimes the egg will pass and the hen will recover. There can be an egg even if the female is not set up for breeding. If you are sure it is a male, or it is definitely not an egg bound hen, it could just be a buildup of waste on the feathers, which could eventually reach the vent and prevent additional by products from being passed. The pile up can be due to poor grooming of itself or excessive feather growth under the tail. It could also be caused by an illness such as enteritis (inflammation of the intestine), worms or other parasites, internal tumors or fatty tumors in the vent area, diarrhea caused by a change in water or food or some other illness. The area will have to be cleaned no matter what. Breeders often quickly pull the feathers surrounding the area of the vent to insure the fertilization of eggs. Tiny amounts are plucked though so as not to rip or tear the flesh. Some breeders prefer to use sharp scissors to trim the area carefully. If the area were heavily soiled, using the scissors method would be better to cut out the matted feathers. Rinsing the bird's vent area under lukewarm water will help to soften up the waste and clean it up. Then blot the area dry with paper towels. You may need a helper. Unless you hold the bird's head firmly between your thumb and index finger, you will most likely be bit some more. Often sick birds have a nasal discharge that builds up on the feathers above the cere (nose). This should also be cleaned while you are at it with some warm water dabbed on and gentle rubbed and blotted. Pay attention when you are holding the bird. If the bird feels light and feels very bony in your hand, it is probably not going to live long. It is in the process of dying from some cause. If the bird feels very fat, try to determine if fatty tumors are involved. They can be in the chest or lower abdomen. These birds can live for years unless the tumors become too large and cause imbalance, become open wounds, etc. At that point, the bird should be euthanized. If it is a fatty tumor, it may require that you trim or clean the area at regular intervals.

A trip to a vet for a bird such as this can be stressful to the bird and very costly, especially if blood work or other diagnostic tests are done. Then there is the medication and having to administer it. Birds cost about $15 to $50 so you will have to decide if you want to let nature take it's course or seek professional help.
Good luck.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Sandra Replies:
Marcia,
Thank you for your reply. Unfortunately Sky was very ill. The vet x-rayed and he (so, was not an egg) had a very enlarged liver and very little lung capacity. She said Sky's lungs were almost filled with fluid. She attempted to draw it off, but they kept filling up. (She had used a mild anesthetic so the X-ray could be done) She suggested euthanasia before Sky woke up again. I agreed, but still feel awful. The name Sky came about because his breast was a beautiful blue and it looked like a puffy white cloud in the center. (The sky looked much the same when I left the vets office-more tears) I miss his voice. Another bird, Jade (green) shared the cage. They have always been together. I goofed this morning and said "Good morning Sky & Jade", before I even realized. I hope Jade is OK. I did get lots of "chirping" when I got home from work today. (Can't help but wonder if he is asking where is Sky?) Thanks for listening, Sandy (You are also right about the expense- $237.00, which I really could not afford, but @ least I know there was nothing else to be done)

Sandra

Tri-State Response:
Sandy,
Sorry to hear that you ended up losing the bird. Like I said, it is hard to make a diagnosis without seeing the bird or running diagnostic tests. Unfortunately, you found out how costly that can be but at least you know that the fault was not yours and there was nothing else that could be done. We become very attached to pets and it is difficult when they die, no matter how small they are, they can hold a big place in our heart. I myself am a breeder and exhibitor that has dozens of birds and so I do not get as attached but I did lose four birds this month, two cocks just wasted away. They were two and fours years old. Birds are good at keeping their illness hidden until it is really too late to save them. This is a predator/prey instinct that is ingrained in them. It wasn't until I caught up all the birds to set up for breeding and selling, that I realized they were not well. Those two were just feathers and bones in my hand. I also lost two hens out of the nineteen pairs set up due to the complications of breeding. Because birds are so small, illnesses often take the birds in just a few hours or couple of days. You are probably right in that the remaining bird misses his buddy too. Perhaps you and he can spend a bit more time together for a while until some of the void has faded somewhat.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

September, 2004

Inquirer 1

Hello! My name's Stacey. My budgie's name is Patchez. She's 6 years old and I purchased her a friend. His/her name is Tibbs and is fairly young, still has most of the bars on his head and a purple cere, but anyway, Patchez is being very friendly to Tibbs, she's constantly preening him/her. Tibbs shows no aggression towards her, but I get the impression that he/she is kind of annoyed. He/she'll sometimes nip or squawk back at her, but sometimes Tibbs will just let her. I'm confused, should I purchase a separate cage for Tibbs, because as of right now they're both sharing one. And is Patchez showing breeding behavior towards Tibbs? Thanks! Stacey,

Tri-State Response:
Every case like yours is different and depends on the individual birds. I have only a few comments and you should keep your eyes and ears open for any aggression and then take action and separate the birds if necessary.

1) The budgie/parakeet is a flock bird. This being said, if your original bird was tame and a pet you frequently took out of the cage and were close companions for each other - then you were it's flock. The bird's needs for companionship and bonding were filled by a human rather than a bird or numerous birds. There was no need to get it a "friend" after so many years. On the other hand, if your Patchez was always left in it's cage and never or rarely taken out or played with, then it deserves a companion.

2) Many creatures are very territorial and this includes your type of birds. A hen especially can be very aggressive to any newcomer and can even murder its cage mate. As a companion, you would have been wiser to purchase an older second bird. Your case would be similar to an adult pushing around a child. A child is not going to win but another adult would at least have a chance to defend themselves. The sex of the second bird would not matter unless you had planned on breeding and your Patchez would be considered too old anyway. I can't say whether her actions are normal or breeding behavior. They often will preen and even feed each other even if they are not a true pair as part of their normal behavior.

3) It is usually advised to introduce a new "friend" to an existing pet on neutral ground. How would you like it if someone just appeared in your bedroom that you had never met before and announced they had moved in? If a new puppy or dog (or even a new baby human) is introduced to a household, it should be done on a sidewalk or neighbors yard. It should never be done in the first dog's home or yard. Often letting each animal smell the other by using a rag or some other piece of material that holds the other's scent precludes the first meeting. This gives creatures a chance to meet without the need to defend their territory against the new intruder. In birds, scent does not come into play. Ideally, your two birds should have met through individual cages placed near each other. If they showed a willingness to like each other, they could be housed in a larger cage together.

4) You are fortunate that the older bird did not attack the new one but that does not mean it will not still happen. If they are getting along, that is great. The cage should be of adequate size for the two birds. Make sure that along with the preening, that older bird is not landing some serious bites on the newcomer. Once a bird sees that another one is afraid, it will usually be merciless in the attacks.

I hope I have covered your concerns.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 2

Hi! I have a few questions about English vs. American budgies. My daughter (age 9) loves budgies and has a blue pied male American budgie as a pet. We got him young and he is like a little puppy dog following us around. She tamed him very well!

We just went to our first budgie show up in Conn. but we couldn't stay too long. Here were some of the things that we were talking about with some people at the show:

Thanks,
Nancy B.
New Jersey

Tri-State Response:

Hello Nancy,
Thank you for visiting our web site. I copied your E-mail to better answer each of your questions. I will now get to your answers.

1. We would of bought an English budgie for her but she was very concerned that to show an English budgie, the bird could not be tamed first as a pet.

Marcia's Response: You must first understand that the shows here in the US are for owner bred birds that have had a coded band placed on the leg of the bird when a few days old. A bird that is unbanded or has another breeder's band is not eligible for showing in BAA or ABS sponsored shows. Secondly, birds sold at shows are often surplus breeding age stock or at least not babies, which are a better choice for training as a pet. Once a breeder begins to produce babies, it would be hard to try and tame all of them. I disagree that a tame bird would not be able to be shown if it had your own band. The problem that might occur is that the bird would be so tame, that when a judge approached the cage, it would not stand at attention. It would probably try to hang off the bars or try to play. It would then be disqualified for not showing just as a bird that stayed at the bottom of the cage, regardless of the quality of the bird.

2. We were told that the English budgies are harder to breed than the American budgies.

Marcia's Response: Generally, this is true. Budgie hens sometimes take longer to mature and many show no interest in breeding or incubating the eggs they do lay. With English hens there is a greater chance of fatty tumors, clear eggs, egg binding and so on. Many males are less fertile than American males. It must be remembered that there are many variables in the breeding room. Some people may have a banner year with production while others may breed very few. I myself have been having a few bad years in a row while others are breeding just fine.

3. My daughter would like to show and breed budgies but it is very important to her that the birds are friendly first. Is there any way to show American budgies? Are there shows for them?

Marcia's Response: I love to hear that new people, especially children, are interested in coming into the hobby. I have addressed this in #1. Exhibition budgie shows are just that and as a rule do not have American classes. Some "all bird" shows allow exhibiting of pet birds, including purchased ones that are American or English. Two or three of these clubs are in NJ and they may still have these divisions at their shows. They are primarily either canary or parrot oriented though. There was a club (The Connecticut Association of Aviculture) that had a sanctioned budgie division but due to some problems I think they stopped it a couple years ago. Most of these all bird shows are not ABS or BAA sanctioned and the judge is usually just a breeder. The birds are usually lumped together in classes in this division and there is really no competition as few true breeders enter these competitions. Our club has been around for twenty years. Many of our members started out as "pet people" and even now we have wonderful members that are not at all interested in breeding. We decided to try a Pet Division this year for them and as an effort to attract new members. It drew two entries from a "new" person. This part of the show is not ABS or BAA sanctioned. Our show manager asked me to judge it because I have been in the hobby for over 20 years.

4. We have clipped her bird's wings because she has a younger brother and sister. We are concerned with the bird flying out the door! Can/should a show budgie's wings be clipped? Can you show them that way?

Marcia's Response: I am an advocate of clipped wings for any bird deemed to be a pet; especially those that are allowed freedom from a cage. We have owned a Severe Macaw for about 15 years because someone else did not believe in clipped wings. You cannot show a bird with clipped wings. Well, you could, but it would be disqualified immediately.

5. We live in NJ and heard about your show a little bit too late. I think that it is great that you had a pet division at the show. Will you have one again next year? If so, we will be sure to attend!

Marcia's Response: I am pleased you are "local" and perhaps it would be wise for you and your daughter to think about attending meetings if truly interested in breeding and exhibiting. Meetings are generally in Matawan, Marlboro, Spotswood, Trenton and Somerset. All are in the central NJ area. Our monthly meetings are currently held at a member's home and run from 2:00 until about 5:00. You can attend a meeting or two and decide if you would like to become a member. If you are interested let me know and I will give you addresses and phone numbers. I have two girls, ages 5 and 3 that show signs of interest in Mommie's hobby. Another man from the Cape May area has four sons aged from roughly 7 to 12. He and at least one of the boys are at a meeting most of the time. It can be a wonderful family hobby, at least until the kids are teenagers. Our fall meetings start this Sunday the 19th in Aberdeen (Matawan) at the home of Chuck Romano our Secretary and October 17th at my house in Spotswood. October is our baby show and futurity and it would be a great way to learn. I did review our pet show in #3. As far as next year, we will be discussing this year's July show and next years show this Sunday at our September meeting. I have seen times changed and I will be the first to admit that 10 to 20 years ago, I would have been against a junior or pet division. As the President of the club I feel very strongly that clubs like ours need to be thinking out of the box. It is time to do untried things to attract new members. Even though we had just two entries, I was pleased. To read that you said it was a great idea and that you would come next year for a "Pet Division" helps me know we are taking the right approach. I do believe there will be a Pet Division at future shows because the majority of our members feel as I do. I am sure you met some of the people I know on Saturday and I hope to see you at a meeting or a future show. Hopefully, your questions are answered. Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Nancy's Response:
Dear Marcia,

Thank you for your answers to my questions. Yes, she already belongs to the ABS - about 1 ½ years now. My daughter, Kay, really loves budgies so I thought that she would like joining the organization.

Ok, so to show a bird, it has to have your own band on it. So, that means breeding them. (I'm getting it! Slowly!!) I guess I was just trying to show the bird that we have already.

Thank you for inviting us to your meetings. We would love to come and see what it is all about!

Thanks,
Nancy

Inquirer 3

Today my two beloved birds Bob who was a lovely blue colour and Jocky a grey died within a couple of hours of each other. Both were well loved birds approx four years old, fed and watered regularly and kept clean and were allowed freedom to the house and made less mess then my three children put together. Recently we had a new carpet laid and wondered if it could of effected the health of the birds. Both birds looked healthy and seemed ok but before they died seemed to be having breathing difficulties. I can't believe how quickly they died. Have you any ideas.

Regards Karen

Tri-State Response:
Karen,

Yes it is very possible that the new carpet had something to do with their death but without an autopsy you would not know for sure and may not know even with one. If the carpet came within a few days of their death it may be one of the chemical compounds becoming airborne from the carpet manufacturing process or the additives that make it stain resistant. People and other pets can get ill too but birds are very susceptible. You could contact the carpet store about it or find information from the Internet. It could also be just a coincidence that they both died of no apparent reason or due to coated cookware overheating or other reasons. As a breeder and exhibitor, I assure you a bird can be any age and just die suddenly without any apparent cause. If the carpet is really new, I would wait a few months before getting any more pets and I would try to ventilate my house to allow the toxic substances to escape.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 4

Hello,

I once posed a question to your secretary, Chuck Romano, as to how to determine the sex of a bird. He instructed me to pick it up and shake it to see if I could hear any eggs rattling around. To this day, I have had no success with the technique, but now have two very dizzy birds. Perhaps Chuck can provide me some additional advice? Thank you.

Jim

Tri-State Response:
Jim,
You have a good sense of humor and that sounds like something funny man Chuck would say. I will forward your E-mail to him. You have probably figured it out by now but on most varieties an adult male has a very blue or pinkish purple cere above the beak. A hen will have a brown or whitish very pale blue area.

Marcia Halbert
President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Jim's Response:

Hi Marcia,

Yup, I figured it out. Used a little different technique, though - observation! The blue-cered male will warble and call and feed the female and, in gratitude, she knocks him off his perch. There's a parallel there to life, I'm sure.

And I worked with Chuck for the last few years at Verizon. He was kind enough to give me one of his birds for my elderly mother. That bird and his mate give her lots of laughs.

Thanks,
Jim L.

October, 2004

Inquirer 1

Hi there!
I have 2 male budgies that are currently in separate cages (they were fighting). I have now got a cockatiel in my collection and was wondering if it would be a good idea to put all 3 into a new, large cage? Would all 3 male birds get along? Or does it vary bird to bird?
Thanks for any advice.
Sarah

Tri-State Response:
Sarah,
Every situation is different and it may or may not work out fine. I have no idea what you consider to be a large cage and you provided no measurements. If your birds do not have clipped wings, you need to be aware that cockatiels are very powerful fliers for their size and also have beaks that are more powerful than a budgie's. Years ago I had a large walk-in mixed aviary with about forty cockatiels, a combination of about forty finches that included societies, zebras and gouldians, a pair of rosellas, a few button quail and several budgies. Everyone seemed to get along pretty well. They had a selection of foods and a variety of different types and sizes of perching, including tree branches, placed high and low. I offered plenty of free flight space without obstructions and private areas. The size was about 6' wide x 18' long x 7' high. Zoos often use large aviaries to display multiple bird varieties that are from the same area; temperate zones or eat the same foods. In my opinion though, unless it is a good-sized cage or flight I would not recommend this. For what you are considering, I would say an absolute minimum of 3' square is needed but that doesn't mean there won't be any bloodshed or physical harm. It is probably better for the average pet owner to keep species separate. You have already experienced problems with the two budgies -- and they are of the same species.

Marcia Halbert

President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society

Inquirer 2

On October 16,2004 a friend found a young parakeet in his yard it appeared to be dying. He gave the bird to me because he knows that I love all animals and that I would care for it if it lived. Truthfully I am not at all educated in the care of parakeets. The first thing I did was to take a warm towel and gently wrap the bird in it to warm it up, I then boiled an egg and I mashed the yolk mixed with a little water from some cooked rice. At first I had little hope, as the bird was nearly limp. I managed to open the beak and using an eyedropper I carefully dripped a little juice into the mouth. I continued to do this and after a few moments I saw a response. Through the night I repeated this every hour. I also placed the bird in a box with a small light to keep it warm. I'm happy to say that this morning my new little friend is flying! Now my question is how long should I continue to nurse this baby and how and when do I introduce it to seed and veggies. I do not know how old the bird is but I sure it is very young, as I've said it can fly. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
My sincere thanks,
Paula

Tri-State Response:
Paula,
Sounds like you have saved your little friend. It was probably cold and hungry but may not be necessarily a young bird. If the tail is full grown, about 4 inches, the bird is at least about 6 weeks old. If there are no bars on the area of the head closest to the beak to the area on top of the head above the eyes, the bird is at least 4 months old. If there is a band on the leg, it may indicate the year of birth. The egg was a good choice as it is high in protein. By all means begin offering parakeet seed and water. If the bird is young or weak, be sure and put the feed and water on the bottom of the cage as well as in cups by a perch. Millet spray, seeds still attached to a stiff wood-like stalk, is especially good for this purpose of providing a first meal or as a treat. It is easy for birds to hull. You can also offer some water-dampened bread. Parakeets eat almost anything but I would wait a few days before offering any fruit or vegetables. They sometimes cause diarrhea and your bird has been recently traumatized and cannot risk such an ailment at this point. If you plan on keeping the bird it would be a good idea to have its wing feathers clipped so that it does not also escape from you as it did from the last owner. Good luck.

Marcia Halbert

President, Tri-State Budgerigar Society